IDS 114.XX issues

John Owner New York Posted   Latest   Edited  
Discussion
Industry
Programming
2009 Lincoln MKZ 3.5L (99T) 6-spd

Last week when I saw IDS 113.06A time out I felt a pit in my stomach. Having heard from various techs across the country about the difficulties with 114.01 and subsequent updates. I reached out to Rotunda to be proactive and asked if 114.05 has corrected all the issues involving PMI/Reprogramming. The representative told me there are still issues especially with … model years but assured me that it worked flawlessly on 2012 model year and up. He also went on to tell me that as of 9am est he had 25 tickets concerning 114​.​xx that he was sending to Ford programming engineering. I then asked him if I updated and had issues what would be my course of action? He basically told me make sure virus is off, no other programs, etc. I explained to him that I have been using IDS for a long time and was aware of these precautions. I also explained that there is no longer the safety net of 113.06A being available. He then told me curtly if I had issues to call.

Having heard of the issues. I decided now would be a good time to switch IDS over to a fresh laptop. I installed 114.01 and updated to 114.06 over the weekend. I knew I had some Fords to do this week. So I went to do a PMI on a 2009 Lincoln MKZ PCM today. I did a proper PMI leaving old PCM in and then installed replacement PCM. It then updated the new PCM and then told me turn key off to reset module. I thought I was in the clear. Then IDS stalled and a blue screen appeared that could not be cleared. I then called Rotunda and was asked if this was a fresh install, what windows version, did my laptop have IDS on it prior, etc. At the end the Rotunda rep told me there was nothing more he could do for me. He acknowledged that there are issues. The issues seemed to be isolated to … model years. He said he felt for me but the only thing I could do is send an email via the Motorcraft site under "other questions" with my issue. He then went on to tell me try to uninstall, run IDS cleanup utility, reinstall, etc.

Well, I tried every version of 114​.​xx on two different laptops with two different operating systems and kept getting blue screen, Testman Errors, etc. I was there for close to 4 hours.

Obviously 114​.​xx has issues affecting it. This has been documented. This has also been going on for a month. Where is the watchdog with this? The issues have been well documented here on DN and other venues for weeks. I do not want to hear about filling out a SIR. This demands immediate action. This hiccup is affecting my business dramatically. This was a new shop using me today. Even after explaining the issue with Ford and showing the shop owner the "chatter" on the web do you really think he believes me? Do you think he is going to call me back? I have several Ford programmings to do this week. To be told that there is nothing more they can do for me knowing there is an issue is unacceptable. 

The industry needs an entity that can hold an OE's feet to the fire when issues like this occur. To get these problems rectified promptly.

I am sure this is not affecting to much at the dealer level their lions share is 3 years and newer. To be fair IDS has always been a favorite of mine and felt very confident with it. That trust has been shaken however. 

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Justin Mobile Technician
Utah
Justin Default
 

You are absolutely right John. But really what do you think will happen if someone is put in charge of such a venture? Don’t we have an example of how that goes for us already? Add GM to the list of manufacturers that aren’t getting it together.

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John Owner
New York
John Default
 

Justin, Yeah wasn’t GM down this morning for the umpteenth time this year. It never ends.

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Scott Owner
California
Scott Default
   

Hi John, Well it appears like it's back up again, which doesn't help with my earlier situation. And on the subject of GM - what's with the "Account Verification Code" that needs to be resent every time I log in? Or, if I haven't used it for a few hours I have to log back in and get another verification code sent. This is an aftermarket/indy shop request that is not being requested of GM…

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John Owner
New York
John Default
 

Scott, I feel your pain. Chrysler has verification codes which are a pain in the ass as well. Like I have always maintained it is not a level playing field.

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Scott Owner
California
Scott Default
 

Hi John, That's the thing, GM has always been very good in the past, and one of the reasons why I chose to specialize with that manufacturer. Now they're turning into all the other car manufacturers that I was thankful not to be working on. I'd like to think it will get better, but I have my reservations. The beatings will continue until morale improves...

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John Owner
New York
John Default
 

Scott, Unfortunately, all the OE's are guilty of this. I do diagnostics/programming on GM, Ford, Chrysler, all the Asians, and VW/Audi. Owning factory tooling for everything I service. It is a constant battle to level the playing field. The crap they pull makes my head spin. A couple of weeks ago I had a Suzuki to program. I paid my money and the website accepted. But, I could not get the…

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Chris Owner/Technician
New Jersey
Chris Default
 

I don’t want to sound ignorant but isn’t that part of what nastf is supposed to handle or is that just when it’s related to security issues I haven’t updated yet and I don’t have any fords scheduled but now that I said it out loud I’ll probably get 3 calls for fords tomorrow...

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John Owner
New York
John Default
 

Chris, Shhhh. Don’t hex yourself.

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Donny Owner/Technician
Colorado
Donny Default
 

Yes, Chris. It is exactly what NASTF does. The problem is that people complain in forums rather than create Service Information Requests and if they do I get things that are not actionable. Sometimes, though rarely, there are issues where the OE does not have a solution and those can take months to resolve. Nearly every complete SIR that I have seen since late 2017 has been resolved in a few…

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John Owner
New York
John Default
 

Donny, I have been sour on the SIR process since your predecessor broomed me away with a Nissan ABS programming issue that required Nissan ASIST and he was told by Nissan I didn’t need it. Even though I provided documentation and TSB’s. If you want me to file a SIR to this cause I will gladly do so. But, this is an issue that has been brewing for weeks and well publicized both here and other…

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Donny Owner/Technician
Colorado
Donny Default
 

John, Actionable for NASTF to do what we do is providing the exact information I asked for and is in the signed service agreements that many but not all of the OEs signed with NASTF years ago. I do not have enough time to cruise these forums. I am fortunate enough that when these come up I either see them because the abstract that comes from DN tips me off or others send them to me. I work on 5…

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John Owner
New York
John Default
 

Donny, I am not talking about cruising forums. You asked me to give you issues pertaining to what I see in the field two years ago. I gladly sent these issues detailing issues by OE. I have inquired several times about the status of these issues and it is always been met by you and your staff are shorthanded and such. It has been two years. I have filed a SIR about my issue today. SIR #981. I…

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Donny Owner/Technician
Colorado
Donny Default
 

To start with, I have been in your situation more than a few times and YES it is very irritating. Unfortunately, what I have learned in over 20 years of working directly with OEs is that you do not get anywhere with a comprehensive approach. I am trying to explain how we get things done with OEs. People within these groups that deliver scan software are very isolated from users except when…

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John Owner
New York
John Default
 

Donny, Awesome. Will these meetings be recorded for NASTF members to see.? Or, at least minutes published for NASTF members to review? There is a major disconnect with what we do in the field and the boardroom. Let’s get this IDS crap straightened out. Agreed?

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John Owner
New York
John Default
 

Donny, Furthermore, now that a proper SIR has been filed what is the time frame the OE has to answer the issue? If any? Since I filed the SIR do I get to see what the OE responded with since I am a NASTF member? Thanks.

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Donny Owner/Technician
Colorado
Donny Default
 

They are supposed to respond within 24 hours. I got an "I am on vacation" from the department head's email and have heard nothing from the other 2 folks I copied in. This too is unusual for Ford. I am going to try a little different angle tomorrow morning. You do get to see the response. I cut and paste them into the SIR when there is a response from me. Most SIRs the OE goes directly to the…

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Donny Owner/Technician
Colorado
Donny Default
 

Outcomes will be put out in a press release. There is a major disconnect and that is why we are having these sessions to move that needle.

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John Owner
New York
John Default
 

Donny, Thank you for the update. I am not totally surprised by the "I am on vacation" and the silence. What if any penalty for the OE if they do not answer in the agreed time? This is an issue probably no one wants to get involved with. But, this needs to be rectified promptly. My vote and the easiest would be to allow version 113.06A to be viable again until they figure out what went wrong…

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John Owner
New York
John Default
 

Donny, Any updates on hearing from Ford? Or, the questions I have posed? Thanks!

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John Owner
New York
John Default
 

Donny, Any news????????

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Donny Owner/Technician
Colorado
Donny Default
   

Only one unacceptable response. I have replied and indicated that you guys have as much or more field experience with the IDS as any dealer tech and that support is not very supportive. I did forward 3 more SIRs on the topic. I also reached out to their association to see if I can get some additional help moving this or at least getting an answer that makes sense. This is not the norm but it…

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John Owner
New York
John Default
 

Donny, So what if any is the penalty for an OE that does not answer a SIR within 24 hours? Or, does not answer intelligently? What is the next step here? I have an OE tool that I paid for that does not work as intended. Will Ford/Rotunda make restitution for time loss? Extend my subscription?

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Donny Owner/Technician
Colorado
Donny Default
 

The answer is that the requestor can take legal action. Of course that rarely happens because it is a bigger pain than the tool not working. I have a couple of tricks still up my sleeve. The problem I have is that the key players in this are all taking vacations and are clearly not reading email while they are out. With the exception of having to do more in depth work with MB USA on getting…

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John Owner
New York
John Default
 

Donny, Appreciate the efforts. I really do. But, in the end I have a tool that is not making me money and I cannot do my job properly. I have to ask. Why would Ford allow "key players" to take vacation with no contingency plan? This 114​.​xx issue has been going on for several weeks now. These "key players" have been on vacation that long? Sounds like Washington :). This has been…

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Bob Owner/Technician
Massachusetts
Bob Default
 

This seems to be a growing problem. I lost my shirt on a 2008 Ford F150 because of 114​.​xx Then, after that I tried to program a new parking brake module in a volvo. Guess what, I couldn't download the file because "Volvo" was having a problem. My 3 day sub ran out with no resolution. Today the issue was fixed. I bought another 3 day sub, downloaded the file and I was able to…

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John Owner
New York
John Default
 

Donny, Any updates from Ford or my SIR?

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Donny Owner/Technician
Colorado
Donny Default
 

I see no way to answer these questions. Why are the folks in charge of the division on vacation for at least 2 weeks? That is the email auto response I am getting. I have very literally emailed and or called every single contact I have at Ford. I even had a friend that works at another manufacturer reach out. He and I both agree that this "totally unplugged" approach is unprecedented for Ford…

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Justin Mobile Technician
Utah
Justin Default
 

Donny here is a list of questions you have not answered. What can we do as an industry to not be held hostage by an OE and their support again? What is NASTF learning from all of this? So what if any is the penalty for an OE that does not answer a SIR within 24 hours? Or, does not answer intelligently? Again, I ask with these sessions will they be videotaped for NASTF members to watch? Or…

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Justin Mobile Technician
Utah
Justin Default
 

Come on Donny. Answer The questions John has asked. I am learning a lot about how little NASTF is representing the VSP members.

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Donny Owner/Technician
Colorado
Donny Default
 

Justin, how many of our committee calls have you attended? Too busy to attend? Have you read the meeting minutes we post on our Slack channel? If your information comes from VSPs who are disgruntled because NASTF now enforces 11 year old rules and they are having to comply then you would be very wrong about how we take care of them. I had a VSP in Washington State tell me the story about how he…

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John Owner
New York
John Default
 

Donny, So how do we participate in these committee calls? I have asked time and time again to be involved and help out and never have been asked. Where is the information on this Slack channel? Is it posted on NASTF website? The issue with 114​.​xx is no small issue and quoting your mission; I work on one mission only; to do everything possible to ensure that those who repair…

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Donny Owner/Technician
Colorado
Donny Default
 

nastf​.​org/i4a/pages/inde… All Committee meeting information is posted here. This will not be a good link in the next few months as the entire site is being reconstructed on another significantly more modern platform. You have to be added to the slack channels by committee so figure out which meetings you want to attend and we will add you. Slack also pushes out reminders on our…

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Donny Owner/Technician
Colorado
Donny Default
 

Ford has reached out through support. I copied all the logs and SIRs provided to me to them. Thank you for that. I asked if they would make 113 live again while they sort this out. Aftermarket folks are helping them to resolve this. I have also connected aftermarket experts to help JLR resolve issues as we have a similar situation going on with Land Rover. the information, logs etc you all…

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John Owner
New York
John Default
 

Donny, This is great news. I have to ask who are these "Aftermarket folks" that are helping? Why is Ford/Rotunda needing aftermarket help? What was the reply to making v113.06A viable again? Thanks.

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Donny Owner/Technician
Colorado
Donny Default
 

You would be surprised at how many of the automaker tools are made by or get field assistance from the aftermarket. Since then a friend from Ford has called and I was also able to pass all the collected data through her. She understood the requests and said she would track down someone to escalate. Now it’s almost 4 ET. I am really hoping she can help make 113 available again I also had a…

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John Owner
New York
John Default
 

Donny, I do realize how much the aftermarket is involved in the world of OE tooling. Case in point Snap On with OE VAG 6154 interface. If I was a smart guy I would have never got involved with this business. I would have became a cop or lawyer like my Mother wanted. :) Hoping to see some results and hope all have learned from this.

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Donny Owner/Technician
Colorado
Donny Default
 

That makes 2 of us. My mom was just happy when I stopped running around the country with a guitar.

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John Owner
New York
John Default
 

Donny, Any further word from Ford on this issue? Or, if they will make v113.06A viable again?

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John Owner
New York
John Default
 

Donny, Any news on this subject?

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Donny Owner/Technician
Colorado
Donny Default
 

The Saga continues. I have engagement. It is truly crazy. I went through their compliance folks to get to this point. I will continue. I do not have an answer to Can we have 113 back or when will you have this fixed. Yet!

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Anthony Technical Support Specialist
Pennsylvania
Anthony Default
 

Hi Donny: I read that the other day and have mentioned it to some customers having the issues. If the other 2 shoes drop (rating agencies), that's the time to get worried, very worried. Guido

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Caleb Technician
Indiana
Caleb Default
 

Are you guys talking about FJDS or IDS 114.06 or both?? The reason I ask is because I have used many versions of FJDS 114 and have not had any problems yet!! Not saying this too act like I know something no one else does. Just surprised I have not had any issues yet. However I dont think I have done anything as old as 2010.

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Bob Owner/Technician
Massachusetts
Bob Default
 

Caleb, I think the problems are happening on vehicles older than 2010.

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Saul Owner
Texas
Saul Default
 

I dont think so, since im dealing with a 2013 Explorer not able to program abs, with as build data, missing i formation to get the job done. as build us not giving me the last line 760-02-02, i tried Autel and it is also requesting the input for that sale line which is not giving by the as build data.

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Bob Owner/Technician
Massachusetts
Bob Default
 

Well then I think Caleb should go buy a lottery ticket!

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Bob Owner/Technician
Massachusetts
Bob Default
 

There needs to be some kind of accountability. Who pays for the countless hours lost when uninstalling and reinstalling software over and over and still not getting the job done. I know we all understand that you can't bill a customer 6 to 8 hours to program a computer. At least not if you ever want to see that customer again. Who pays for all the lost man hours? The manufacturers now have…

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John Owner
New York
John Default
 

Bob, You know where I stand on this. You bring up some excellent points.

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Anthony Technical Support Specialist
Pennsylvania
Anthony Default
 

Hi John: I don't know if this has legs but ask them to unlock v113.01, again. That's what they finally did after we bitched for weeks about it being hosed. (Note the past tense.) Guido

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John Owner
New York
John Default
 

Guido, You know as well as I do they let 113.06 linger way longer than usual. They know they have an issue. What they should have done is not let 113.06 time out before 114​.​xx was ironed out. But, then again it’s the 3 years and newer they care about. It’s a sham. I will go back to discs and my VCM1 if I have to.

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John Owner
Mississippi
John Default
 

do u save the version to your computer when u download it I always do so I can go back to the last version if there is a problem and I don’t ever up date mine til i have to iids lets u program 1 version behind

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John Owner
New York
John Default
 

John, I save everything. Unfortunately, the last version of IDS that worked properly has timed out.

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Benjamin Diagnostician
Tennessee
Benjamin Default
   

I ended up with Testman errors today programming a new PCM 2006 Lincoln Zephyr using 114.06 IDS. The programming completed but during the key cycles I also received the dreaded ”Testman has stopped working” error. I was able to delete the session files (to prevent an incomplete programming event detected) and go back in and program the tire size and axle ratio. I was also able to do a parameter…

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Donny Owner/Technician
Colorado
Donny Default
 

Benjamin, I saw this just as I hit send on my submission. I have had this exact same thing happen on an 06 Zephyr in an earlier version of IDS. may not be a problem exclusive to 114. Same actions on my part. I still service the car and it has had no problems since.

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Benjamin Diagnostician
Tennessee
Benjamin Default
 

Thank you for both of your responses. I held out as long as I could in the 113’s and just updated to 114.06 last week. I was well aware of the 114 issues which is why I never updated. My first thought was “well here we go,“ when I received the error message. I am just thankful Ford’s are forgiving and there are usually ways around a programming error.

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John Owner
New York
John Default
 

Benjamin, Good to know.

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Benjamin Diagnostician
Tennessee
Benjamin Default
 

Well great. I was called this afternoon because there is now a traction control light “that was never on before.” I will be headed back to Nashville (40 minute drive) to re-scan the vehicle and see what is going on.

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Saul Owner
Texas
Saul Default
 

I also had issues today trying g to program a 2013 Ford Explorer ABS. im on 114.06, i could it do automatic, so i was forced to do it as build, but couldn't do it either. As i requested the as build for the Vin number, i started inputting the data manually. the last line giving by website as build was 760-02-01 but in IDS last data requested was for line 760-02-02. So i couldn't finish the…

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Chris Owner/Technician
New Jersey
Chris Default
 

Saul I've run into this before and have used as built from another vehicle that had that line and put that number in to get the job completed also I've sent requests in to support and gotten an email back with a line of code to put in to complete.

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Brin Diagnostician
Florida
Brin Default
 

I ran into the same issue yesterday on a 2005 Mazda Tribute. I was running 113.06 and hoping to get away with it until the situation was resolved. Unfortunately, I was forced to update and got the dreaded Testman Errors. I agree that they should allow the aftermarket to use the stable 113.06 until beta testing of later releases have been verified stable. In my case, the mobile call was near…

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Matthew Mobile Technician
Illinois
Matthew Default
 

Well, I gained a new customer today thanks to a referral from a friend. This shop was using the dealer for programming.... they told him they are not programming any 2010 or older! 08 Explorer, error and blue screen after erase and programming, just during the key cycle process. Deleted the session, PCM communicated during module scan and then did parameter reset with no problem. Built Ford…

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James Technician
Georgia
James Default
 

On iatn there was mention that you can edit the version number in the registry and keep using 113.06. For those having problems it might be worth looking into until Ford has a permanent fix.

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Richard Owner/Technician
Texas
Richard Default
 

Has anyone noticed that 115.02 has not come out yet? I have 2 trucks here needing the axle and tire size programmed to the ECM to finish out. I been check on the release to see if they fixed the problem enough. Only 2 days late. Maybe they will skip this one and go for the one on October 9th.

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Donny Owner/Technician
Colorado
Donny Default
 

All, Ford has a resolution that has been tested and confirmed to solve the problems with these PMI issues. It probably will not make it out the door tomorrow but they are running double shifts with their Dev team to get it out to everyone. I will be in the air tomorrow but as soon as I get confirmation of release I will post.

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John Owner
New York
John Default
 

Donny, This is great news! Cannot wait to test their claim that it is fixed. What was the issue?

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Richard Owner/Technician
Texas
Richard Default
 

115.02a is released. I don't have the trucks anymore. Has anyone used it to see if it works?

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Donny Owner/Technician
Colorado
Donny Default
 

Richard, You are fast. Yes, I just received notice while I was on a plane that Ford has released 115.02A it is the fix for the older vehicles and it was tested yesterday on two of the vehicles that were down and performed as intended. It should be available in all channels by the time you read this - including Canada. The source is the same but there are multiple servers that must update…

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John Owner
New York
John Default
 

Donny, Thank you for the update and clarifying that 115.02A should work and be the fix we have waited for. Can't wait to try it. It would be nice to have confidence in my IDS again. I appreciate that Ford has apologized for the hassle. But, that does not make up for the lost time, revenue, and customer trust this has caused me and countless others. I will put that behind for now. I would…

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John Owner
New York
John Default
 

Donny, Wondering if you had time to chew on my questions.

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