Chrysler PT 1.6 - No crank no start

Samuel Mechanic Örnsköldsvik, Sweden Posted   Latest  
Question
Driveability
Electrical
2001 Chrysler PT Cruiser Classic 2.4L 4-spd
P1686
U0100 - Lost Communication With ECM/PCM "A"
U1415
U1414
U0141 - Lost Communication With Body Control Module "A"
No Crank / No Start

PT cruiser 1.6L 2006

The complaint is following - Intermittent No start /no Crank. Security light flashing.

Scanned with a Launch and got following codes.

PCM - p1686 - No SKIM BUS Messages Received

Tipm - u0100 - U0100 Lost Communication With ECM/PCM

Airbag - u1415 -Implausible/missing vehicle configuration data - and u1414 - Implausible/missing ECU network configuration data

Skim - u0141 - U0141 Lost Communication With Body Control Module -------------------------------------

From time to time it will start and run I can erase the codes, and it can restart a couple of times then back to the no start.

I can read codes and data from all modules.

I have checked Power and grounds to the PCM, all good. Also checked PCI data at the PCM when it started and with no start. see images. I dont like the elevated ground when its a no start.

The more I dig in to this, the stranger this is. First, the 1.6L model seems to be a EU only model so not much info out for it. But its not simple.

I will include some of what I have found about the network in this.

"However, on models with an optional 1.6 liter engine the Powertrain Control Module (PCM) uses the DaimlerChrysler Programmable Communication Interface (PCI) data bus system in combination with the CAN bus to form a hybrid bus system."

"The 1.6L gateway is only on vehicles being shipped to Europe. There is no domestic application of the 1.6L. The TIPM is still the main CAN gateway, the additional gate way goes from CAN C to J-1850 for the 1.6L powertrain controller."

So this car have two gateways, CAN-B - CAN-C and PCI.

So I think I need to check this extra Gate way. Since i'm not sure how its connected.

Or do anyone have experience in this? All inputs are welcome.

Cheers.

0
Victor Owner/Technician
Doral, Florida
Victor Default
 

Are all reference voltage feeds present during no crank/no start episodes? If not check for a shorted sensor.

0 Default Ð Bounty Awarded
Samuel Mechanic
Örnsköldsvik, Sweden
Samuel Default
 

Thanks for The suggestion, i will look in to that.

0 Default Ð Bounty Awarded
Anthony Technical Support Specialist
Kirkwood, Pennsylvania
Anthony Default
 

Hi Samuel: I don't know if this will help you or not. In this country, Chrysler didn't have any CAN vehicles until 2004 (Durango). On those that did and used the TIPM as a Gateway, the TIPM used Diagnostic CAN C. This means that the only module the scan tool connected to was the TIPM. The other modules connected to the TIPM on the backside using CAN-C, CAN-B or CAN-IHC and Hybrid PCI bus, or…

0 Default Ð Bounty Awarded
Samuel Mechanic
Örnsköldsvik, Sweden
Samuel Default
 

Hi Anthony, yes this is an Europe version of chrysler. And I,m scoping The pci, its only one wire and goes from PCM--DLC--2nd gateway. 2nd gateway is then connected to CAN-C - ABS - Airbag -TIPM. According to The wiring diagram. I have also scoped The Can-B network but cant see anything wrong there. Thanks.

0 Default Ð Bounty Awarded
Anthony Technical Support Specialist
Kirkwood, Pennsylvania
Anthony Default
 

Hi Samuel: You have a vehicle not offered in the US with topology not used in the US with an engine (EJD, also used in the Mini) not used in the US built by an out of business company for a manufacturer that went bankrupt after being divorced and was sold since then. :) From what I can see, your vehicle was built in Mexico using a Tritec engine (Brazil). TechAuthority is the service…

0 Default Ð Bounty Awarded
Allan Instructor
Winnipeg, Manitoba
Allan Default
 

I would start by checking grounds. Your elevated ground on the scope pattern during the no crank/no start condition is a problem. Where is your scope connected.

+1 Default Ð Bounty Awarded
Samuel Mechanic
Örnsköldsvik, Sweden
Samuel Default
 

Yes, I did continue on the 2nd gateway trace and found it under the driver seat. Someone was there before and rigged the ign + feed to the module. So I needed to clean up that mess and found one for the grounds to the module was bad. I will recap when I have the time to fix it. I have narrowed it somewhere from c106 and G105.

0 Default Ð Bounty Awarded
Samuel Mechanic
Örnsköldsvik, Sweden
Samuel Update
 

Late recap, I did fix the ground to the 2nd gateway under the seat. It did fix the problem. As you can see in the picture this ground is going to connector C1 and C2 on this module. 6V with KOEO in the first picture before repair. And grounding it in the second picture fixed it. Theory in the network setup in this was key to find the problem. Interesting to see that it was no fault code even…

0 Update Ð Bounty Awarded
Anthony Technical Support Specialist
Kirkwood, Pennsylvania
Anthony Default
 

Hi Samuel: As Albin is wont to say: "electricity is smarter than people. It won't go out if it can't find its way home." I'm glad to hear that you got to the bottom of it. I have a couple of questions, if you don't mind. 1: Did you (the shop) get paid for the total amount of time involved? Or did you lose? 2: Is this (the answer to the question above) normal in your locale? TIA, Guido

0 Default Ð Bounty Awarded