2007 Ford Expedition no crank

Doug Owner/Technician California Posted   Latest  
Resolved
Driveability
2007 Ford Expedition XLT 5.4L (5) 6-spd (6R75)
P1260
P1000 — Manufacturer Controlled DTC
U0100 — Lost Communication With ECM/PCM "A"
U0101 — Lost Communication with TCM
U0121 — Lost Communication With Anti-Lock Brake System (ABS) Control Module
B1600
U0102 — Lost Communication with Transfer Case Control Module
No Crank / No Start

This customer has a no crank with these multiple lost communication CAN faults as well as the P1260 in the PCM. The anti theft dash light is not on or blinking. I scoped the CAN communication lines and they of which I included this picture. The resistance of the system is 60 ohms.

No work has been done to the vehicle before the situation occurred and The customer only has one key. If anybody can help direct me on where to go next I would greatly appreciate it! Thank you. 

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Interesting
Jose Diagnostician
Indiana
Jose
 

Can you access the PATS module to see the status or able to retrieve codes?

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Doug Owner/Technician
California
Doug
 

Yes, there are no codes there and after clearing the codes in the IC none returned… so far. After doing a PCM data stream ready test every PID tested OK except all the injectors.

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Enrique Diagnostician
California
Enrique
 

Since most of the codes of lack of communication are being seen by the IC I would suggest to test wiring to and from IC, instrument cluster problems are common on these vehicles too.

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Alex Diagnostician
Australia
Alex
 

Is the 5V reference up? Is the Batt up to snuff (Just did an intermittent crank no start Ford Fusion that had a fuel pump changed and several sensors renewed. Issue was a Batt on the cusp and occasionally falling below acceptable Voltage on crank) If 5V reference and Batt are good, Powers and Grounds to the IC check. CAN signal looks good from what i can see (pic resolution is that that good)…

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Thanks
Kyle Mechanic
Illinois
Kyle
 

Run a network test with your scan tool so which can see which modules are or are not communicating.

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Doug Owner/Technician
California
Doug
 

I assume that the can network looking good if a certain module wasn't communicating it just could be the power or ground to that module causing the no crank?

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Kyle Mechanic
Illinois
Kyle
 

Yes but it's always a good practice to verify the CAN network to the module in question in addition to the powers and grounds.

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Stephen Owner/Technician
California
Stephen
 

I agree with Kyle, see what module is not on line. Check your powers and grounds, that fuse box could be water damaged due to a leaking windshield

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Helpful
Timothy Owner/Technician
Wisconsin
Timothy
 

You're thinking way old for a water leak from the windshield. That issue went away in the early 2000s. The SJB is no longer even in that location, as it was in the early 2000s, totally different side of the vehicle.

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Elon Owner/Technician
North Carolina
Elon
 

Sorry Bro, saw the same problems when the SJB was moved to the passenger side below the A pillar. Replaced at least 4 of them in 3 years due to water intrusion.

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Doug Owner/Technician
California
Doug Update
 

As I mentioned after clearing the ICM faults they haven't come back. There is a U0100 Lost Communication with the PCM in the ABS and transfer case modules and the airbag module has a U1900 CAN bus fault. Also B1483 Break Is pedal input circuit fault. There was a shift interlock code before I cleared it's in the ICM and they mentioned it was there before also. I'm going back to check more now.

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Alex Diagnostician
Australia
Alex
 

Re B1483, Does the scan tool show that the PCM is seeing the Brake pedal input? No input can be a no crank.

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Timothy Owner/Technician
Wisconsin
Timothy
 

Well, since you've got comm codes in the ABS, can you talk to the PCM? If not, that's where you're headed. Incidentally, since all modules on the HS CAN system put out their own messages on the bus, a scope shot tells you nothing about who can comm and who cannot. The scan tool is a much better tool for this issue. Remember that RMI from bad/failing COPs can shut down the PCM.

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Mark Owner/Technician
Georgia
Mark
 

I would go to obdII freeze frame data and/or look at mode 6 data see what dtc is set in freeze frame. Start with that DTC. The second picture on the right, can bus data picture, I can see a glitch in the second group of data packs. The glitch is mirrored in both patterns(green and yellow). I would also zoom in the picture so you can see it better.

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Burdell Technical Support Specialist
Philippines
Burdell
 

See attachment

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Joe Diagnostician
Texas
Joe
 

Hey Doug, I had 07 Escape or Edge I can’t quite remember but I had p1260 also with an intermittent no crank i recommend new keys and programmed them and shipped the vehicle a week later the car came back with the same symptoms. I went towards the ignition switch to see if I had a crank signal and I found a gps tied in between the ignition and starter signal i believe the used car dealers use…

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Mike Mobile Technician
Illinois
Mike
 

Take a look at the fuse block in the passenger footwell and see if the lower connector is loose and not fully latched

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Mark Owner/Technician
Georgia
Mark
 

Silver Bullet answer is in the scope. See how many days it takes to repair this vehicle. Trainers say it all the time.

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Elon Owner/Technician
North Carolina
Elon
 

Indeed Mark. I would be looking for corrosion in the SJB connectors. I have seen this several times. At least as a good start to cover the basics. Techs today make things much more complicated than they need to be sometimes. I have also been guilty of this and it has cost me a couple of times. Long time Tech, 30 years and running.

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Caleb Diagnostician
Indiana
Caleb
 

If I understand your update correctly after clearing all faults you now have only U0100 (No comm with PCM)??. If that is correct then the vehicle does not crank as well?? If so then you need to check P, Grd, CAN lines, and 5v ref at PCM and that will lead you too the issue.

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Alan Owner/Technician
Mississippi
Alan
 

I have to agree with some of the other members about water intrusion in the right kick panel. I have a pile Smart junction boxs that I have replaced due to water intrusion you need to take it out it takes 10 minutes and inspected thoroughly the explores the Ford Mustangs F-150s I've seen him all with this problem. That's my two cents worth. Best of luck Alan

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Alan Owner/Technician
Mississippi
Alan
 

Doug, I was thinking about your situation and I remembered a old fix from a few years back. … F-150 and Expedition maybe a few more I'm not sure. We had a 06 with a similar issues as yours. When was all said and done and ended up with a defective (FPDM) fuel pump driver module. I remember this part having a very high failure rate. And where it is mounted it is exposed to the…

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Doug Owner/Technician
California
Doug Resolution
 

I want to thank everybody for replying and giving me the experience that I can use in the future! Sorry for the late reply and I feel a bit embarrassed as it happened it turned out to be the starter!? I definitely got sidetracked by all the codes in this situation. I learned a lot though! And to access the top bolt in this you have the right combination of tool or it's almost impossible to get…

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Alex Diagnostician
Australia
Alex
 

Brilliant. Good job finding it. The codes can really throw you. I mentioned the Fusion about that had a battery on the cusp. It also had a bunch of U codes. I've leant that , U codes and no comms are often the result of a low battery and sometimes other peripheral things. Thanks heaps for the learning opportunity.

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