Free training on Permanent DTC's , IUMPR , "fault isolation", running of monitors

Steve from Irvine Instructor Posted   Latest  
Discussion
Emissions

I was asked at the last minute to put a class together. 

On Monday July 2nd at 6 pm I will be presenting a train the trainer on: OBD; IUMPR and how to use it to verify the OBD state of health; Permanent DTC's -- how to clear them using "fault isolation" data; how to run monitors faster, more accurately with high level of consistency. Some of the vehicles that we will be covering: Ford, GM, Chrysler,VW, Audi, Porsche, Jaguar, Land Rover, BMW, and Honda to name a few brands. 

We will be meeting at Gustafson Brother's Automotive training center in Huntington Beach. 

Please RSVP at …

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Luis from Lake Forest

 

Technician
 

I would love to attend Sign me up please

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Maurice from Geebung

 

Business Development Manager
 

Hi Steve yes if it wasn't that I am in Australia I would have loved to be there as well. I am probably about to show how diagnostically dumb I am by asking the question what is IUMPR?

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Luis from Lake Forest

 

Technician
 

In use Monitor Performance Ratios if I’m not mistaken

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James from Olathe, KS

 

Educator
 

You are correct

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Maurice from Geebung

 

Business Development Manager
 

Isn’t that Mode$08? I would be interested in knowing how you go about clearing permanent DTC’s. I think you might mean running monitors to force a completion of a permanent code?

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James from Olathe, KS

 

Educator
 

It is under Mode $09 for IUMPR. Yes you have to run the monitors and get a pass before the permanent code is erased.

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Steve from Irvine

 

Instructor
 

James,

the PDTC is not always associated with a monitor. Running monitors needlessly is something that we will be talking about. This is where "fault Isolation" comes in.

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William from Ashland

 

Diagnostician
 

Would love to be there myself, but I'm on the wrong coast.

Love to see the presentation though!!

Willie

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Maurice from Geebung

 

Business Development Manager
 

I have asked around within my little network of techs and this is the reply from one of them

Hi Rod / Maurice

I believe that the permanent DTC's are available in Mode $0A (10) ?

Under EOBD (Euro 5+) I have read some info on the Euro IUPR (In-Use Performance Ratio), which is based on the US OBD IUMPR. Both are in essence are used to track how frequently monitors really run on the road. Data reported to ARB / EN for review. * IUPR does not add any new diagnostic requirements - it is all about certification of a vehicle and frequency of monitors etc.. in all-day use * IUPR looks at how often a diagnostic process / monitor will run under under real world driving conditions (gathering that IUMPR would be much the same)

Hope that this helps..

Regards

Scott Thomas SL-Tech ABN … PO Box 867 Warrnambool VIC 3280 E. … M. … | F. …

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Rick from Dracut

 

Technician
 

$01 Request Current Powertrain Diagnostic Data

$02 Request Powertrain Freeze Frame Data

$03 Request Emission-Related Diagnostic Trouble Codes 

$04 Clear/Reset Emission-Related Diagnostic Information

$05 Request Oxygen Sensor Monitoring Test Results

$06 Request On-Board Monitoring Test Results for Specific Monitored Systems

$07 Request Emission-Related Diagnostic Trouble Codes Detected During Current or Last Completed Driving Cycle

$08 Request Control of On-Board System, Test or Component

$09 Request Vehicle Information, Vin, Calibration#

$0A Request Emission-Related Diagnostic Trouble Codes with Permanent Status

Found this list in an old training manual. 

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Steve from Irvine

 

Instructor
 

Scott,

You are spot-on in regards the material, yet it can be used for so much more. The so much more is what we will be covering.

Mode $0A is the tenth mode, not mode $10. permanent DTC's are read in this service mode. Fault Isolation will help you clear the PDTC. 

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Gil from Woollahra

 

Manager
 

Hi Steve would you consider doing a live feed for us on the other side of the pond

Gil

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Steve from Irvine

 

Instructor
 

Hi Gil,

This a very brief overview of the material. The level of intensity that we can go into will take 8+ hours.

I am doing this class for a friend and have found when there are a number of techs attending the material flows better.

Lets see how this one goes first.

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Gil from Woollahra

 

Manager
 

Ok Tanks®

+1

Luis from Lake Forest

 

Technician
 

Steve is this class similar to the smog update class? 

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Steve from Irvine

 

Instructor
 

Yes, for the base. But we will be getting into fault isolation and how to use the information to verify that fault is no longer present.

The IUMPR will be covered in a little more details.

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Nate from Los Angeles

 

Educator
 

Sign me up would love to attain 

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Steve from Irvine

 

Instructor
 

Just RSVP. …

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Timothy from Brampton

 

Diagnostician
 

Wish I could be there however I am too far north and east. Would defiantly be interested if someone up here put on something 

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Danny from Losangeles

 

Technician
 

Shoot, I missed the cut off, the class is filled. I wanted to ask about IUMPR. I don't know what the numbers my generic scanner captured mean.

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Steve from Irvine

 

Instructor
 

It means that the OBD system is in a good state of health. You are missing some data in your screen capture.

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Jim from Frederick

 

Curriculum Developer
 

Danny, I read your chart as follows.

Of the detected 14590 Key cycles, the system judged the driving profile conducive to fully testing the OBD system 7286 times. Of those 7286 times there was an opportunity to test the Catalyst Monitor 7281 times. The Catalyst monitor actually completed 8424 times. This is not unexpected as many catalyst monitors will actually run more than once per cycle if applicable. Jumping down the list to EGR/VVT we see that the Monitor completed much more often and is an indication of how frequently the system will attempt to run it. Dropping down to EVAP we see it only encountered conditions less than half the rate of other systems, This makes sense with the list of enabling conditions for EVAP and why so many techs struggle to understand why it is so hard to complete.

Why do we care? Using these numbers before a diagnosis can show indications of blocking conditions from current or previous issues. (depending on how the manufacturer treats the data) Using these numbers can also indicate if conditions were met during a test drive, (Top number increments up) our monitor of interest had conditions met (number increments up) and the monitor ran to completion (condition count increments up). If all these things occurred the current $07 and $06 conditions are more useful.

I agree this can be a large and fun topic on how to gain direction and insight. This is a quick and glossed overview of how I have been reading the data. 

Jim

+1

Steve from Irvine

 

Instructor
 

Jim,

Its a good overview. But there is much more than fun and we should care (if you are in a state that does emission testing)

There are governing agencies that use the numbers for the vehicle's state of health. In the emission programs this information is golden. In California this will be used in part to judge repair longevity as well as state of health of the OBD system. 

This information is about 13 years old, or was started in 2005. When used in the right manner, will aid techs running monitors. Coupled with fault isolation, permanent DTCs will not pose a problem. As we teach techs how to use this information, the verification of repairs will become simpler. The information will indicate a suspended monitor, when you learn how to use it. 

When I was learning about this many years ago, I was using this for monitors verification. What made it difficult is there is other OBD information that some scan tools does not support. The information is there, but after calling the scan tool manufactures they just say we do not support it. I am disappointed with the response "the information may not be valid". The scan tool is not valid. But as this goes forward this will be a very sore subject, and depending on affiliations could cause strife in the industry.

Steve

+1

Maurice from Geebung

 

Business Development Manager
 

arb​.​ca​.​gov/msprog/obdprog…​.​pdf

Found this link and thought it might be useful while on this subject

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James from Olathe, KS

 

Educator
 

Thanks! Do they have one for Light Duty Vehicles?

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