Ford 6R80 strategy, data PID's, and diagnosis

Marlin Technician Estacada, Oregon Posted   Latest   Edited  
Discussion
Driveability
Drivetrain
2012 Ford F-150 XL 5.0L (F) 6-spd (6R80) — 1FTFX1EF8CFB16203
Extended Shift Times
Transmission Slipping

I am hoping to get some feedback here regarding testing procedure for these transmission. SI has an tremendous amount of theory and functionality information, but very little regarding testing for mechanical faults, as seen below.

Feel Concerns: Soft/Slipping (Some or All)

The unit which I am currently working on exhibits extended shifts through at least gear 4; above that it is at least diminished, but the vehicle speed is quite high during higher gear shifts with much APP application. The symptoms are worst after driving for a few miles, and during moderate acceleration (approx. 40% APP). Immediately after a shift is complete, engine RPM sometime flares, resulting in a large ETC reduction. This sometimes cycles repeatedly before the next shift occurs, and may continue through that gear. This occurs before TCC enabling. WOT produces better shifts. Line Pressure Control Desired goes up to 890 KPa, with correlating amperage (<.95A), but Torque Control is only requested briefly while shifting is in progress. I am baffled as to why ETC is actively and drastically reducing engine power, but no Torque Control is occurring according to the PID.

What do you do to evaluate or test for mechanical faults? I cannot find any test procedures except air testing after removal of the valve body, and visual inspection of components. I think it was foolish to not included a line pressure sensor. I have used everything I can find on IDS, and confirmed that there is slippage occurring, but I have not figured out a satisfactory procedure to determine the exact fault. I REALLY want to monitor actual line pressure!

--EDIT-- I am not sure what happened, as I had included the SI for addressing the highlighted symptom. Apparently the system doesn't like formatting. Basically, it says that it could be any one of the obvious possible culprits, but provides no testing except for checking the fluid level, which we did.

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Dave Mobile Technician
Ironton, Ohio
Dave Default
 

Marlin, cannot really answer your question, but in my experience the lack of any electrical codes usually points to internal trans wear if slippage is occuring. These systems are very good at detecting electrical and performance problems. When in a situation like you have I will monitor all of the engine pid that are used to calculate load. These are a big part of the pressure control strategy …

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Marlin Technician
Estacada, Oregon
Marlin Default
   

Yes, load calculation is critical, and was one of the first concerns that I had; it stays flat right through the ETC fluctuations, and I have found no other indication of any related fault. The PCM is clearly responding to excessive increase in input speed; i.e., the input speed increases more rapidly than it should relative to output speed, which is immediately followed by lowering ETC command…

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Marlin Technician
Estacada, Oregon
Marlin Default
 

I am not sure what happened, as I had included the SI for addressing the highlighted symptom. I will try again.

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Ben Mechanic
Chesnee, South Carolina
Ben Default
 

SI is oddly limited in some ways on these. If you are determined to check pressures, you can. Sort of. Above the cooling lines fittings is torx head bolt. It is the "converter pressure" port. And all you get. There is no official spec that I know of but we do have observed "known good" transmission readings from ATSG. Just running at idle though. Park: 85 psi Reverse:85 psi Neutral:85…

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Marlin Technician
Estacada, Oregon
Marlin Default
 

Caleb sent this link to me. sonnax​.​com/tech_resources… I did finally find the port listed in 307.01 Mechanical Components and Functions, Disassembled Views. It is labeled "Line pressure tap plug". However, according to the Sonnax article, this accesses the pressure after the converter release regulator valve, or the bypass clutch control regulator valve, depending on whether the…

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Caleb Diagnostician
Mishawaka, Indiana
Caleb Default
 

Hey Marlin here is a couple pics of the line pressure test port. It is hidden right behind and above the shift cable bracket just above the trans cooler lines on the drivers side of the case. Hope that helps,have fun!! diag​.​net/file/f2jjgymdd… ​ diag​.​net/file/f649wuwak… ​

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Glen Owner/Technician
Arthur, Illinois
Glen Default
   

Do you know if the adaptations where cleared and maybe the shift point road test was not done? Did you check the Solenoid body strategy? ZF training has been an eye opener for me and I still don't know much. 1 observation I would make is SSA is on in 1-4 Also lets not forget a valuable resource right here diag​.​net/msg/m60nas7spv…

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John Owner/Technician
Marion, Iowa
John Default
 

Do you have access to the clutch application chart, It is under specs in the Ford si, The solenoid chart is there also, look for something that is common to all of the shifts you are having problems with. Unfortunately For has decided that a line pressure test is no longer needed.

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